“Liberals forgot the source of the values they defend”. Really loved that one Matt. Couldn’t be more spot on in terms of diagnosing the mess we’re in right now. Thanks❤️
There is so much to love about this conversation. First of all, just listening to you and Philip Goff, both of you so articulate and so precise in your use of language, soothes my soul. These days people in general, and especially those in the media, are so emotionally wrought that it’s quite painful just listening to them speak, regardless of the veracity of the content. Taking the time necessary to say what you mean clearly and with kindness toward your conversation partner and also toward your audience, what a rare talent. Much appreciated!
One of your best Matt. Religions must evolve with more updated meaningful metaphors. For elucidation of the idea of a God with limited power, recommend the ideas of philosopher Nicolai Berdyaev as summarized by the Russian theologian Romilo Knezeviv on the Binary Ontology of Uncreated Freedom, available on academia. edu.
Matt - deeply appreciative of your work over the years ❤️ I am KEENLY interested in your take (if any) of the reported “findings” of Googles Quantum AI (Willow)? What I heard this morning for the first time was absolutely mind- blowing (IF true!)
The video below had so many aspects that resonated deeply with your process perspective.
I would deeply appreciate hearing your thoughts (however briefly) about this.
Thanks so much, Matthew - How unfortunate that such channels are not truthful about what the facts (and "findings") actually are...
My "bias" and hopes are evident and admitted - I was so thrilled at the possibilites (at the end of the video) because they were so commensurate with your philosophical (and my theological) musings...
I did do a "deep search" with ChatGPT - which confirmed the legitimate direction this research will take - e.g., "But the mere fact that a leading tech company’s quantum lab is discussing consciousness experiments is notable – it signals a willingness to push the boundaries of inquiry. Neven has argued that investigating quantum consciousness is a legitimate scientific question, even if it’s a long shot, and that modern quantum technology may finally allow us to gather data on it."
Thanks again for graciously taking the time to respond!
When you start entertaining the idea that God must be limited in order to remedy the ‘problem of evil’ and suffering, perhaps it’s time to accept the fundamental error in the logic that God made the physical world…!
Christianity has a lot to answer for this basic confusion that it has been touting for almost two millennia.
This conversation would have been greatly enriched if someone had contributed the idea that God could not possibly create suffering, evil or anything other than the pure love that is the Spirit, because He (I’m sticking to it!) can only extend in his own likeness.
What he created (the Sonship, the one mind, life, consciousness or however you want to name it) must, nevertheless, have total freedom to extend any idea that it chooses to invest with belief, and herein lies the loophole by which the world as we know it - a mishmash of joy and suffering, ‘evil’ and goodness - can come into (seeming) existence.
But since this world is not in accord with the will of God, it must remain illusory, and only appear real to us for the apparent elapse of time that we continue to believe in it, having forgotten our true nature.
All sounds very idealistic, yes, but living these principles is incredibly empowering and liberating, especially in the face of great suffering and loss.
The minute we accept that to be seduced by suffering or attack of any kind is entirely our own choice, is the minute we become free to experience the joy of God’s presence in any circumstance, which in fact never went anywhere while we were lost in our dream.
Interesting links, I think Steve Taylor is mistaken when he claims his panspiritism is not a form of idealism. Idealism does not require the belief that matter isn't 'real', rather that it has no mind-independent reality. Taylor's position says that matter is ontologically antecedent and dependent on 'fundamental consciousness' for its reality, and is therefore a form of idealism.
Western culture (in particular) is based on three fundamental propositions: We are intrinsically separate from God, the World Process and from each other.
This reference provides a critique of these presumptions
“Liberals forgot the source of the values they defend”. Really loved that one Matt. Couldn’t be more spot on in terms of diagnosing the mess we’re in right now. Thanks❤️
Theology, science, and philosophy are all ways to explore the world, and they all require continuous adjustment and optimization.
This was extra good. You think out into the after of it, rather than it trying to tie you still.
There is so much to love about this conversation. First of all, just listening to you and Philip Goff, both of you so articulate and so precise in your use of language, soothes my soul. These days people in general, and especially those in the media, are so emotionally wrought that it’s quite painful just listening to them speak, regardless of the veracity of the content. Taking the time necessary to say what you mean clearly and with kindness toward your conversation partner and also toward your audience, what a rare talent. Much appreciated!
One of your best Matt. Religions must evolve with more updated meaningful metaphors. For elucidation of the idea of a God with limited power, recommend the ideas of philosopher Nicolai Berdyaev as summarized by the Russian theologian Romilo Knezeviv on the Binary Ontology of Uncreated Freedom, available on academia. edu.
Great trialog. I love hearing from Philip Goff. His "Why?" book is fab.
Matt - deeply appreciative of your work over the years ❤️ I am KEENLY interested in your take (if any) of the reported “findings” of Googles Quantum AI (Willow)? What I heard this morning for the first time was absolutely mind- blowing (IF true!)
The video below had so many aspects that resonated deeply with your process perspective.
I would deeply appreciate hearing your thoughts (however briefly) about this.
References:
https://youtu.be/Vpk0ZXdzCZg?si=ICjKTSNarEil41qv
https://chatgpt.com/share/67fcd9a9-11a8-8009-a3cc-bf76d76d4ebe
Hmm, unfortunately that video is mostly made up.
Thanks so much, Matthew - How unfortunate that such channels are not truthful about what the facts (and "findings") actually are...
My "bias" and hopes are evident and admitted - I was so thrilled at the possibilites (at the end of the video) because they were so commensurate with your philosophical (and my theological) musings...
I did do a "deep search" with ChatGPT - which confirmed the legitimate direction this research will take - e.g., "But the mere fact that a leading tech company’s quantum lab is discussing consciousness experiments is notable – it signals a willingness to push the boundaries of inquiry. Neven has argued that investigating quantum consciousness is a legitimate scientific question, even if it’s a long shot, and that modern quantum technology may finally allow us to gather data on it."
Thanks again for graciously taking the time to respond!
When you start entertaining the idea that God must be limited in order to remedy the ‘problem of evil’ and suffering, perhaps it’s time to accept the fundamental error in the logic that God made the physical world…!
Christianity has a lot to answer for this basic confusion that it has been touting for almost two millennia.
This conversation would have been greatly enriched if someone had contributed the idea that God could not possibly create suffering, evil or anything other than the pure love that is the Spirit, because He (I’m sticking to it!) can only extend in his own likeness.
What he created (the Sonship, the one mind, life, consciousness or however you want to name it) must, nevertheless, have total freedom to extend any idea that it chooses to invest with belief, and herein lies the loophole by which the world as we know it - a mishmash of joy and suffering, ‘evil’ and goodness - can come into (seeming) existence.
But since this world is not in accord with the will of God, it must remain illusory, and only appear real to us for the apparent elapse of time that we continue to believe in it, having forgotten our true nature.
All sounds very idealistic, yes, but living these principles is incredibly empowering and liberating, especially in the face of great suffering and loss.
The minute we accept that to be seduced by suffering or attack of any kind is entirely our own choice, is the minute we become free to experience the joy of God’s presence in any circumstance, which in fact never went anywhere while we were lost in our dream.
https://gavinmounsey.substack.com/p/spiritual-autodidacticism
Robert Wright, contact your lawyer.
https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-God-Back-Readers-Pick/dp/031606744X/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2DGVNF0IJ0UN3&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.OThJmz1s56soYHGd0xk3BDrJ7PapLVeB2VkVZSk25UnbxxgtztZX1k-N0urMQdu24S3nuUk4ok-P-lLMTmrNTJH9rThmju_N7KMlZOMVLeU.cYBfRrg4mYRFi9ENY5qUmMMAVup7O4ONT9kdhBq0Fvg&dib_tag=se&keywords=evolution+of+god+robert+wright&qid=1743258921&sprefix=evolution+of+god+%2Caps%2C137&sr=8-1
Steve Taylor has taken panpsychism and come up with a variation - panspiritism which is distinct from it.
https://philosophynow.org/issues/131/What_is_Panspiritism
Ken Wilber has "Spirit-In-Action" and involution preceding evolution.
https://www.integralworld.net/visser99.html
Interesting links, I think Steve Taylor is mistaken when he claims his panspiritism is not a form of idealism. Idealism does not require the belief that matter isn't 'real', rather that it has no mind-independent reality. Taylor's position says that matter is ontologically antecedent and dependent on 'fundamental consciousness' for its reality, and is therefore a form of idealism.
Please find two references which provide a unique Illuminated (panpsychic) Understanding of the non-human inhabitants of this mostly non-human world
http://www.fnmzoo.org/wisdom-teaching/a-contemplative-state-of-exaltation
http://fearnomore.vision/world-2/not-merely-that
Also http://beezone.com/adida/god-is-not-elsewhere.html
Western culture (in particular) is based on three fundamental propositions: We are intrinsically separate from God, the World Process and from each other.
This reference provides a critique of these presumptions
http://beezone.com/current/three_great_myths.html
It is also the most powerful vector of the universal Scapegoat drama
http://beezone.com/adida/there_is_a_way_edit.html